Tech-Priest

Discussions pertinent to the rules rewrite

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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby NeillC » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:31 am

astroshadow wrote:Additional suggestion for Electro-Capacitors:

Potentacoil transfer - Transfer charge (OB) from one willing tech priest to another (0OB)


Was there any feedback on this?
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby horzabora » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:44 pm

NeillC wrote:
astroshadow wrote:Additional suggestion for Electro-Capacitors:

Potentacoil transfer - Transfer charge (OB) from one willing tech priest to another (0OB)


Was there any feedback on this?


This change will not presently be put into play.
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby mindwanders » Sat Nov 01, 2014 11:23 am

Charm the Machine Spirit has increased in cost and had a time requirement added to it.
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby evgeny » Sun Nov 02, 2014 6:53 pm

As the person who uses this power the most I'd like to point out a slight flaw with the change you have made which makes the power a pointless waste of points. (in my opinion)

I will be comparing the new Charm the Machine Spirit (CMS) to basic Mechanicus Implants (MI)

1. To get full use of CMS i.e. both Repair and Cogitator Hacking you need to spend 12 xp. To get it at MI you only need 3 xp as you can spend the starting 3/15 xp during character creation which you can not spend anywhere that much better anyway.

2. The time requirement. You either spend 30sec with CMS or up to 60sec with the actual card. This might change your skill use time from 5min to 4min 30sec, that's relevant... also can you honestly tell me that folks actually spend the whole 5min doing that test?

3. And this one is the main reason why CMS power is useless. It costs 2OB to us while MI costs only 1OB, for pretty much the same thing . Now you might argue that it prevents you from getting corruption on some tests but isn't that why we have high Integrity.

4. And this is not really about this power but what fallows it. There are two Advanced powers, one of which still does absolutely nothing and the other allows you to use offensive power which will do nothing to most monsters, a mass stun power which stuns your allies or a shield which is actually pretty good if you didn't have to spend 15 xp (6 for CMS + 9 on advanced) on nothing to get it
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby mindwanders » Sun Nov 02, 2014 7:11 pm

Using the basic talent you are limited to a single repair decks worth of cards. For larger tests it's not uncommon for us to duplicate challenge cards making it impossible for a single tech priest to solve the challenge. Removing cards from the test vastly increases your ability to solo those challenges.

And yes, those RP times are a deliberate part of the flow of our linears, especially when challenges need to be solved during combat. So, we will enforce the RP time if we notice someone cutting corners.

I'd agree the Tech Priest advanced talents need another look. Unless you plan to buy one before this event it's unlikely to be revised this downtime session.
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby evgeny » Sun Nov 02, 2014 8:23 pm

Having it cost 2OB is a bit to much even if it allows you to do test alone. Most players will have only 3OB so it's to expensive of a skill to use especially considering how high it is in the chain.

I have no problem with the 30sec as I think that's a good addition.

My suggestion for skill is to either
1. make it cost 1OB and keep the time as that's cinematic,
2. make the base power do both cog hacking and mechanics and do different upgrades for it
3. or scrap the power all together and replace it with something else.

What I don't want is the "balance" update which makes the power unusable so that no one ever picks it and 2 events down it just gets replaced.

p.s. - this isn't wining because i'm loosing my shiny. I'm thinking about it in terms of balance.
p.p.s - if you are nerfing this because of my pc, I'm a really bad example for this as I have spent pretty much all my xp to do what I do with Cog Hac and Mechanics tests using this.
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby horzabora » Sun Nov 02, 2014 8:37 pm

evgeny wrote:Having it cost 2OB is a bit to much even if it allows you to do test alone. Most players will have only 3OB so it's to expensive of a skill to use especially considering how high it is in the chain.

I have no problem with the 30sec as I think that's a good addition.

My suggestion for skill is to either
1. make it cost 1OB and keep the time as that's cinematic,
2. make the base power do both cog hacking and mechanics and do different upgrades for it
3. or scrap the power all together and replace it with something else.

What I don't want is the "balance" update which makes the power unusable so that no one ever picks it and 2 events down it just gets replaced.

p.s. - this isn't wining because i'm loosing my shiny. I'm thinking about it in terms of balance.
p.p.s - if you are nerfing this because of my pc, I'm a really bad example for this as I have spent pretty much all my xp to do what I do with Cog Hac and Mechanics tests using this.


We have done extensive testing with a wide variety of skill levels and characters, it is clear to us that the powers *are* different and that CMS was both under priced and lacked a time limit.

The time limit, as Gordon has said, is important - to answer your question, unless given explicit permission by a ref, I expect every character to have spent approximately the correct time period - no, unless it's dead important for the linear I'm not going to time someone, but I do expect people to keep track of time, like I do for death counters. Personally, having an easily available stopwatch to start when you start doing the test is handy.

The cost is balanced from the testing we have done - the powers are not even remotely the same, particularly with more complex or more specific tests it is very easy to get into a situation where you are unable to complete a test with your powers and must start again (having now spent the OB) using the first power - after all, you can only use each card once. The ability to simply discard the card is exceptionally powerful, as it bypasses this - as previously written, the power simply replaced the basic talent, this was not what we intended. We intend CMS to function as a much more powerful but less often used power.

On the note on corruption, I will simply reply that I am certain a number of characters wished they could have bypassed several corruption card tests at a number of points. Yes, Integrity exists, this functions as an adjunct.

As a final note, your character is a perfect example to use in balancing for the top end of the scale - simply put, you should not be able to overwhelm the system anymore than someone who has bought the first talent should find the system unusable.
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby horzabora » Sun Nov 02, 2014 8:43 pm

evgeny wrote:4. And this is not really about this power but what fallows it. There are two Advanced powers, one of which still does absolutely nothing and the other allows you to use offensive power which will do nothing to most monsters, a mass stun power which stuns your allies or a shield which is actually pretty good if you didn't have to spend 15 xp (6 for CMS + 9 on advanced) on nothing to get it


I accept the point on The Mechanicus Deletes Nothing, this power does require improvement, but we are making only minor balance changes at this point and as yet no appropriate change or power has presented itself, when it does, or when we do a major talent revision, we'll make changes.

I am afraid I must disagree with your assertions for the Lumen upgrade. The addition of 3+ shields on a character (which work in addition to any equipment shield they may possess) is easily worth 15xp, the Mass Stun power is exceptionally useful on a combatant, melee-oriented tech priest, or on a non-combatant one who wants to run away - in both circumstances I can say as a storyteller I have regularly seen characters overwhelmed, and this talent would put a short stop to that. Heck. Combine it with a Tech Priest duo or someone with a shield, charge in, Mass Stun, then brutalise a group of 4+ crew easily. The final talent is a bit poor, we'll probably tack the Vital call into there, although equally you can argue that with a Motion Predictor bionic you get that anyway. But we'll look at that particular power, as it is distinctly underwhelming.
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby mindwanders » Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:54 pm

Lumen Upgrades and Mechanicus Deletes nothing have been reworked.
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Re: Tech-Priest

Postby Artemis » Thu Jan 29, 2015 11:00 pm

snipped from rules update announcement

And for the Tech Priests. Changes highlighted in italics.

When using Omnissian Blessing points to power abilities the cost increases with each use of the same ability. Progression follows as 1, then 2, then 4.

Mechanicus Implants
You gain an effective +3 to Language: Binaric Cant. This may grant you a level above Advanced at character creation, but may not raise your effective level above Epic. In addition, you gain access to the Noosphere, and may ask storytellers for information regarding the state of the Noosphere. You no longer have a skill requirement to service Bionics. You gain +2 to your Omnissian Blessings Pool.

You may initiate a Construct endeavour for any item(s) with a Cost (Construct) of less than 150. These item(s) must all have a Category of Imperial. You are assumed to possess the relevant STCs for all such items.

Once per downtime when undertaking a Construct endeavour you may reduce the Cost (Construct) to produce items from that endeavour items by 75*, you also subtract 100 from the Difficulty (Construct) of the endeavour.

Multiple characters with this talent may work together to reduce the Cost (Construct) and Difficulty (Construct) of an item, but these values may not be reduced to below 25% of their original value, to a minimum of 1 WU.

Upgrade: Upgraded maniples allow you to plug into a console or device to manipulate problems directly. You may use a card not in your Cogitator Hacking deck as if it were in your deck by spending 1 OB and taking one minute of time.
Upgrade: Upgraded maniples allow you greater manipulation when dealing with machines. You may use a card not in your Mechanics deck as if it were in your deck by spending 1 OB and taking one minute of time.
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